The Clinique SPF 40 product is good but not shine-proof. I use it in summer because it’s so non-irritating to the eyes.

I still won’t use L’Oreal group products because I keep hearing comments like “L’Oreal is going cruelty-free” but I’ve not seen changes on the http://www.caringconsumer.com lists. Emily at http://www.livingcrueltyfree.com is very up on this and you might visit her and drop a question.

The best non-shine sunscreen I know is Estee Lauder DayWear Plus SPF 30.

Regarding the better protection by European brands… yeah, I’m not so sure. http://www.paulaschoice.com and http://www.skintour.com are my resources for sun protection information. Regarding 1 or 2 Paula’s distribution centers in Asia, again I’m not certain but it will be on the .com site. Or just drop them an email.

Thank you for your reply.

I’m just worried that company’s that say they don’t test actually “get” ingredients from the bigger company for their final product, so it’s like the testing has already been “done”. . .

I don’t like ordering it online because shipping costs a bomb and then there’s a long delay and I’d have to go without a product, it’s a bit of a hassle.

Actually, Clinique is available here but they’re expensive. Aveda, I’m not too sure. We’ve got an agent selling Paula’s choice and that’s pretty expensive too. However, from those who use products and I’ve read feedback who have oily skin, seem to praise other brands because of their ability to last long and not feel greasy etc.

Someone gave me this explanation about sunscreens.

“in terms of protection, Avene, La roche posay, RoC, Vichy, Heliocare are more reliable as they are European brands and they have to conform to European standards for sunscreens. Which means that their protection from ultraviolet A rays (that cause ageing) are more reliable. Avene has the most reliable long-lasting protection because of Tinosorb M and S ingredients which are proven to last for 10 hours in studies. But you may not want to use Avene because only the emulsion has decent oil control and it gives slight white cast.

The protection from MAC, Bobbi Brown, Clinique, Clarins is inferior to the above brands. If you are willing to accept average (not high) protection, then of this list, I would recommend Clinique’s sunscreen (SPF40) which is tinted and would suit your tanned skin.”

I’m not too sure how true that is about European sunscreens. And, I’ve also emailed Vichy, I didn’t know that they were with Loreal till after I did, but I knew La Roche Posay was and I got a response which seems like Loreal no longer tests on animal? It might be too long of an email to post here so I’ll not do it, I asked for some clarification on the email and awaiting response.

I’m in the mids of trying to purchase a sample from Paula’s Choice, someone did say that it does cause shine and stuff, not too sure on how it’d work with me.

I live in a hot country and it’s always “summer” here so I can’t always be shinning lol. I want to glow not shine lol.

“Paula’s Choice Singapore or China?” << Did you mean there are two locations in Asia?

Thank you again.
Pers

There no perfect answer here. I will sometimes support a company that does not test, even if the parent company does, but very seldom. They hide behind corporate jargon and loopholes to distance themselves from issues they know consumers find touchy.

However, there are so many options of good products, where neither the parent nor subsidiary test, that you can always find a decent option. I’m amazed that you don’t have these choices. Perhaps you live in a small town as I do, but I find ordering it easy. Is there Clinique, Aveda, Paula’s Choice Singapore or China?

I have oily skin too in summer and just deal with shininess. I use powder. I use mattifying sunscreens (that I order online). But in summer, I shine.

The question I’m really wondering about is, Neutrogena doesn’t test on animals right but the parent company does, so is that bad? I mean I read things like, the bigger company probably tests the products are some stage and they’re like we’re against testing and I don’t quite get it . . .

Like, Biore doesn’t test and is against it and Kao the owner does. Would you please enlighten me, thank you.

Thanks for the great comments. I’ve used the Neutrogena Ultra Sheer and Age Shield products. Generally I like them except for one thing that seems a common feature of their products, which is that they ball up when you rub your face/apply makeup over them/reapply sunscreen. My kids call the products “woolly”.

I liked Blue Lizard well enough. It applies pretty well but looks a little clotted out of the bottle.

Have you looked at Clinique Super City Block? It seems very buttery but actually wears well on oily skin (just need a little powder on the center of the face during the day), lovely to put makeup over, titanium dioxide that doesn’t look white, good price point if used for face only, not irritating so I can put it all around my eyes … I really like the stuff. If you try it, do let us know what you think.

High SPF all-titanium or zinc oxide sunscreens I’ve found for body always seem to fall into the Baby products category – like Banana Boat’s Baby, but I would guess there are others.

Coolibar has some terrific options. I really appreciate how well made the hat I bought is (nice broad elastic so it stays on in all but a heavy wind, very effective shading, resilient construction). I saw a lot of the kids clothes this summer and they’re gorgeous. Very sturdy, bright colors, good stuff. They do have good deals on good sunscreens. I’m reminded to go look there today ; they might have some good sales right now. I’m not familiar with Sun Guard but I’m going to look into its effectiveness.

The Green Guide link is fantastic. The whole site is simply outstanding. It’s on the list of Sites To Know. I’ll write about it soon to tell everyone to have a look. Thanks so much for the info!

I am excited about Sun Guard: he wash-in sun protection. Has anyone tried this? Also, Coolibar has some excellent and economical options. Check out Blue Lizard and Fallene. The Vanicream lip guard looks good too

I have very oily skin prone to breakouts and have been looking for sunscreen based on your criteria. I’ve been using Neutrogena Ultra Sheer Dry Touch Sunblock, but I’m now looking for something based on Zinc oxide or Titanium dioxide (no animal testing, of course).

I bought Target sunscreen (with Avobenzone) for my body (very inexpensive and a generous 10 oz bottle). I’d love to get similar products with Zinc or Titanium. I wonder why only Avobenzone is used to produce such inexpensive and effective products.

Like you, I wish Paula would produce higher SPF products with Zinc for a lesser price. Since I use a lot of sunscreen daily (in CA), I need a great product at a good price point.

A suggestion: I read at cosmeticsdatabase.com that Walgreens, CVS, etc. have their own brand of sunscreen at a great price. Has anyone tried any of those products?

Great heads-up on the Ocean Potion and Trader Joe’s. I will definitely try both.

On Debby’s recommendation above, I tried President’s Choice Baby sunscreen. Although it goes on a little unevenly, it only takes a minute to become much more spreadable. It is very very tenacious, even on kids that swim all day. At 5.99 a tube, I’ll be buying more.

I just found your website through Paula Begoun’s newsletter. I join you in your love of her products. My personal favorites are her toners and BHA exfoliants.

Anyway, I’m fanatical about sunscreens, both from a health and appearance perspective. I have two favorites for anything more than incidental exposure:

1) Ocean Potion SPF 50, especially when I can find the Baby version, which is unscented. It’s avobenzone-based, does not sweat off, does not run into my eyes, and has antioxidants. Luckily, Ocean Potion is on Caring Consumer’s does not test list, although it doesn’t show up on Leaping Bunny. It’s also under $10 for a big bottle. Love this stuff!

2) Trader Joe’s SPF 30+. Trader Joe’s is also on the does not test list of Caring Consumer. I can’t wear Ocean Potion on my face because my rosacea reacts to avobenzone. This does leave a slight white tinge and is less easily spreadable than Ocean Potion. A little less run-proof than Ocean Potion, but still fairly tenacious. Less than $5!

It’s great to have you join in. Your words “…just plain work and feel good” say it all. I agree. I really believe that time slowed down for my skin’s appearance when I found those products.

I haven’t used the self-tanner. I’m a bronzer woman myself.
Next time you place an order, you could just buy a sample of self-tanner. That might be a product you have to try out on your own skin, maybe just starting with your legs or a patch test.

Hopefully some women who have used the product will comment.

Hope this helps someone …

- Lisa

This really is not going to be easy. Too bad the Avon product is gone. That must be why I couldn’t find it on the website. FWIW, I looked on the label and it does contain oxybenzone. Maybe California Baby will be the right one for you. It looks like a great (but expensive) product.

I agree with everything you said. I’m glad to see I’m not the only one who finds this issue confusing. Of the hundreds of products out there, the choice dwindles down to almost nothing when you add a couple of criteria that don’t seem all that restrictive.
I posted a picture of the Avon product I bought in the article above. It’s plenty good enough for everyday body use. My kids use it on their face and it’s been fine so far.

Bryan from Paula’s Choice was nice enough to respond to my question, but sited the FDA as to the safety of oxybenzone. Well, I’m not so sure about the FDA’s track record. Sometimes I feel it’s better to be safe than sorry.

So, suncreens I am trying this summer: I bought California Baby for my granddaughter, although I’m liking the feel of that myself, Jason Sunbrella Mineral Based Sunblock, very thick feeling application which I’m not crazy about, and Badger Sunblock, seems a little less thick with the addition of some natural oils, but has a lavender fragrance which some people dislike. I also had Neutrogena Sensitive Skin on the list until I saw that they do animal testing . . . so many things to consider! But, it’s all good . . . the more we read, the better educated we become, and the internet is such a vast source of information.

I will take a look at the Avon one, as I am price conscious as well. I will use the pricier stuff on my face, but need something to slather on arms and legs, as I am a runner and get a good deal of sun exposure.

Thanks so much for addressing this topic!

You bring up a very interesting and important point.

Oxybenzone is a controversial chemical. It’s difficult to find consistent and reliable information about it. I looked at Skin Deep as you did (a great site, but scary). I also Wiki’d it and looked at http://www.smartskincare.com.

It appears that it is a UVB and short range UVA ray block, but a weak one. It is used to enhance the blocking ability of other chemicals.

The concern appears to be with the possibility that it generates free radicals in the skin. Presumably, the danger depends to a large extent on its penetrating ability. I searched “oxybenzone safety” on Paula’s Choice, and found a response to a Dear Paula letter defending (with solid research and references) the safety of the product.

Now, avobenzone, a UVA blocking agent, also has concerns associated with it, but they seem to be related to its stability. Paula also addresses this topic on her site.

I confess that I find it all confusing. I think the jury is still out on this issue. I did not know that oxybenzone appears in the SPF 30 product. Like you, I simply love the Pure Mineral sunscreen. It is so pleasant to use that I feel slightly surprised by the effect each time I apply it. Exactly like you, I also wish Paula’s Choice would make one in a higher SPF. I saw somewhere that higher SPF sunscreens are on their way, so maybe this will be one of them.

I’m going to follow your link now and have a look round. You’ve done a lot of research. What product(s) do you use?

Thanks so much for your great comment.

Love your website, which I found through the link at Paula’s Choice, too. On the sunscreen search, I’m looking for the perfect one, also. I recently became aware that there is a health hazard in one common ingredient, oxybenzone. I learned this from doing some internet searches for a safe suncreen for an almost two year old granddaughter . . . this ingredient raised many red flags. I found a website called Skin Deep http://www.cosmeticsdatabase.com/special/sunscreens/summary.php . They did a very comprehensive study last year on sunscreen effectiveness and safety. I was in love with Paula’s Choice SPF 30, but it does contain oxybenzone. I tried a sample of her Pure Mineral SPF 15, and it’s great . . . I just wish she would make it in an SPF 30 (I suggested it . . . maybe she will consider it.) I’ve had quite a few bouts with skin cancer, so I’m pretty particular about what I use. This website rates a huge number of sunscreens, and if I remember right, lists whether they do testing on animals,too.